Yeah, agreed - I mean, it's like the sonnet y'know. In principle quite simple, but it been around for around 500 years, like haikai, and so the complexities go deep. :-)
I remember a professor in grad school who was Japanese explaining a bit about haikus and how it's not exactly the same as in English like you mentioned. She read some in Japanese too which was really cool! :)
Omg - so sorry I missed this comment last week! Thanks for the lovely words. Oh wow - that must have been super cool getting to learn a bit about haiku from someone who was Japanese and interested in the form. She sounds cool! What was the class in?
This is excellent Dick, so interesting. I read Jane Reichold's book, Writing and Enoying Haiku when I started and felt a little intimidated by all the 'rules'. I would describe what I do more accurately as 5-7-5 verse but I prefer to use the word 'haiku' as it is delicious in itself ha ha. I felt intimidated by whether I was doing things correctly in the beginning and now I worry less and enjoy more. One thing I have learnt is to use less words in life. This comment is not a good example of that! Thank you so much for the kind shout out to my post, I loved your inspiration that came out of it. I look forward to reading more on Haiku Thursdays.
Haha - sometimes more words are needed too! And yeah, re: the "rules" I understand completely! What I like about Japanese haiku is that there are only 3 guides: 17 kana in 575, kireji, and kigo. And that's it. I find in the West 100s of other so-called "rules" are added on (it has to be objective and sketch-like, it has to present-tense, it has to be a single moment, and so on, and so on), to the point where it becomes almost impossible to write anything hahaha. None of these are present in Japanese haiku at all - and imo, have made a lot of people afraid to try haiku. It's a pity really! As you say - poetry shouldn't be about worrying, but about joy and enjoyment!
The other nice thing about Japanese haiku is that while these 3 "rules" are universal to haiku, there are also specific allowances for haiku that are larger or smaller than 17 kana, haiku without kigo (called mukigo), and haiku that have no cut, and are written in a "single image". And there are "plain verses" (hiraku) as well, which only have the rhythmic element. So the "rules" become less like rules, and more like guidelines to help one understand certain poetic devices (rhythm, symbolism, combination). :-) So yeah, for me - these are just "scaffolds" rather than rules y'know. Something to explore, rather than something to dogmatically stick to. I think that's probably what I'll end up writing about next week. :-)
You are very welcome, in terms of the shout-out! I look forward to reading more of your work as well.
Excellent Dick, thank you. I can see that I shall be learning a lot from you! I always intend to 'investigate' my craft more thoroughly but then I just get wrapped up and swept away in the reading of other people's and the writing of my own 😂
Haha - yeah, same a lot of the time. As much as I enjoy theory and digging into the craft, nothing is beats getting swept away in other people's writing and your own! It's something my writing partner says to me all the time: eventually all the theory is just that - theory (nothin wrong with that, of course), but where the magic happens is in reading and writing verociously. :-)
Yes, it seems to me that I reach a point where I feel a little 'static' or 'repetitive' and that's when I read more again and get inspired by far greater writers than I. The off I go again with that new learning in mind and paddle around on my own again for a while. Great process for me, I love it.
Same here. Great break-down of the process. :-) I used to really hate that 'static'/'repetitive' moment, but as I have gotten older, I now realise how integral it is to the process. So I come to look forward to it - cause it means new things around the corner.
This is so fascinating. And people think haiku is a simple poetic form.
Yeah, agreed - I mean, it's like the sonnet y'know. In principle quite simple, but it been around for around 500 years, like haikai, and so the complexities go deep. :-)
I remember a professor in grad school who was Japanese explaining a bit about haikus and how it's not exactly the same as in English like you mentioned. She read some in Japanese too which was really cool! :)
Omg - so sorry I missed this comment last week! Thanks for the lovely words. Oh wow - that must have been super cool getting to learn a bit about haiku from someone who was Japanese and interested in the form. She sounds cool! What was the class in?
It's okay! Yes, it was cool! It was Major Authors. I can't remember how we got on the topic of haikus in class haha. :)
Haha - sounds like a great course! :-)
This is excellent Dick, so interesting. I read Jane Reichold's book, Writing and Enoying Haiku when I started and felt a little intimidated by all the 'rules'. I would describe what I do more accurately as 5-7-5 verse but I prefer to use the word 'haiku' as it is delicious in itself ha ha. I felt intimidated by whether I was doing things correctly in the beginning and now I worry less and enjoy more. One thing I have learnt is to use less words in life. This comment is not a good example of that! Thank you so much for the kind shout out to my post, I loved your inspiration that came out of it. I look forward to reading more on Haiku Thursdays.
Haha - sometimes more words are needed too! And yeah, re: the "rules" I understand completely! What I like about Japanese haiku is that there are only 3 guides: 17 kana in 575, kireji, and kigo. And that's it. I find in the West 100s of other so-called "rules" are added on (it has to be objective and sketch-like, it has to present-tense, it has to be a single moment, and so on, and so on), to the point where it becomes almost impossible to write anything hahaha. None of these are present in Japanese haiku at all - and imo, have made a lot of people afraid to try haiku. It's a pity really! As you say - poetry shouldn't be about worrying, but about joy and enjoyment!
The other nice thing about Japanese haiku is that while these 3 "rules" are universal to haiku, there are also specific allowances for haiku that are larger or smaller than 17 kana, haiku without kigo (called mukigo), and haiku that have no cut, and are written in a "single image". And there are "plain verses" (hiraku) as well, which only have the rhythmic element. So the "rules" become less like rules, and more like guidelines to help one understand certain poetic devices (rhythm, symbolism, combination). :-) So yeah, for me - these are just "scaffolds" rather than rules y'know. Something to explore, rather than something to dogmatically stick to. I think that's probably what I'll end up writing about next week. :-)
You are very welcome, in terms of the shout-out! I look forward to reading more of your work as well.
Excellent Dick, thank you. I can see that I shall be learning a lot from you! I always intend to 'investigate' my craft more thoroughly but then I just get wrapped up and swept away in the reading of other people's and the writing of my own 😂
Haha - yeah, same a lot of the time. As much as I enjoy theory and digging into the craft, nothing is beats getting swept away in other people's writing and your own! It's something my writing partner says to me all the time: eventually all the theory is just that - theory (nothin wrong with that, of course), but where the magic happens is in reading and writing verociously. :-)
Yes, it seems to me that I reach a point where I feel a little 'static' or 'repetitive' and that's when I read more again and get inspired by far greater writers than I. The off I go again with that new learning in mind and paddle around on my own again for a while. Great process for me, I love it.
Same here. Great break-down of the process. :-) I used to really hate that 'static'/'repetitive' moment, but as I have gotten older, I now realise how integral it is to the process. So I come to look forward to it - cause it means new things around the corner.